Career Clinic: Quitting the law at 1PQE at for a business role - a bad idea?

In this current climate, once out the chance of getting back in is unlikely.

If your heart is elsewhere, then do it. No point being unhappy. Though do note, a one year PQE with obvious feelings elsewhere hardly makes you a desirable catch for a firm/in-house.

Anonymous -24 Feb 2011 | 13:42

"There will be other times, other places"

Looks like another wasted training contract for someone who was never really interested in law in the first place (or never really put much thought into what it involved). This is typical of a lot of young lawyers in City firms these days (by young I mean the straight out of university, and often of the GDL variety). I’ve lost count of the number of times I have heard trainees and NQs say things like “I just wanted to try it to see what it was like” and “I’ll do a couple of years in corporate then go into business” or “I just want to try out the City thing”. I think the SRA should introduce a new rule whereby if you leave law within three years of qualification (except on medical grounds) your status as a lawyer is terminated and you have to retrain. I also think the firm that you trained at should be fined the cost of one of the many talented and enthusiastic individuals LPC fees who cannot get into law as a punishment for recruiting people like you who will not make a long term contribution to the profession. Before the “bitter” comments come in – no I am not, but I did have to do it the hard way to qualify and people like this do get my back up.

Another thing that I believe justifies my comments is that law has so many practice areas and the writer could not find one that interested them from the point of view of committing long-term to the profession. This does show a lack of interest in the legal profession as a whole. Ok so Corporate and Banking are not exactly fun or intellectually stimulating (unless cut and paste is your thing) and most lawyers in these areas are boring and lack anything resembling a personality but Litigation, Employment, Media, Competition, Regulatory, Tax, Pensions, Energy? The list is endless.

You have been given a golden opportunity to participate in the greatest profession that there is and you don’t even want it. I hope it is true for you that - “What we do in life, echoes in eternity”.

Robin Van Persie -24 Feb 2011 | 15:12

Go for it

I for one don't see the moral obligation towards the profession Robin Van Persie seems to be implying that you have. It's your career and you can do what you want with it. If the law is failing to offer you what you want, I don't see why you should grin and bear it for the rest of your career.

The fact is that the opportunities for entrepreneurism and advancement in the law just aren't what they were. Twenty years ago you could realistically become a partner in a City firm only three years after qualifying; now, you'd be lucky if you make it after ten, once you've jumped through the hoops of made-up titles like "senior associate" to keep you from having a slice of the pie.

I'd say go for it. Maybe it would be difficult to get back into a City firm as things stand currently, but one thing's for sure: for better or for worse, things won't stay the way they are. You have to back yourself and take a few risks now and then.

Good luck.

theartoflaw -24 Feb 2011 | 15:41

Sanctimonious much?

"You have been given a golden opportunity to participate in the greatest profession that there is and you don’t even want it."

HA! First off, you are delusional if you really think that being a city commercial lawyer is the "greatest profession that there is." If this is the kind of ego massagery you need to tell yourself in order to feel less like the small cog in the gigantic, artless machine you are in then good luck to you, buddy. Second, each of us has to follow our own paths in life and often the course of this is made possible precisely by trying and excluding those choices which do not suit us. I say to the original poster with complete sincerity that if his/her heart is not in law, get the hell out of dodge now or forever hold your peace. Good luck and ignore Robin van Persie!

Rebecca -24 Feb 2011 | 16:05

It's now or never

Either you want the safety and certainty of a salary and a professional career (such as it is in this market) with its decent if not stellar rewards, or you want the uncertainty and risk involved in enterprise, with the potential very small or very large rewards. That’s your decision regardless of your PQE.

If you want to do it, though, I’d do it now. As you get older and more experienced you will have more financial and personal commitments which may prevent you taking bigger risks. You will find it more difficult to think outside the structured, risk-averse environment of legal risks and problems. Plus, what is the point spending another 2 or 3 years becoming good at something you have no interest in?

If you don’t have the stomach to do it now you won’t do it in a few years time, so accept it’s a pipe dream and get on with something else.

Young Fogey -24 Feb 2011 | 16:15

Will you have your vengeance, in this life or the next.....?!

“What we do in life, echoes in eternity”

What, reading Career Clinic?

Bemused -24 Feb 2011 | 16:16

Take it with both hands...if you really want it

If what you really want is to be in business then grab this opportunity now.

Legal experience counts for virtually nothing in the business world - you gain nothing by moving over later.

As for this:

"You have been given a golden opportunity to participate in the greatest profession that there is and you don’t even want it."

...this is the most farcically stupid comments I have ever read. I work in an transactional department in one of the top law firms in the City and most of my colleagues don't want to be here. Why? Because being a corporate lawyer isn't a particularly good job. Its well paid but that's it. If what you are really interested in is the law then you should be a litigator or a barrister or in an advisory area. If what you're really interested in is business then you should be a businessman. There really isn't any point being a corporate lawyer other than the pay and most of my colleagues wish they were "on the business side". Only a minority of corporate lawyers really want to be corporate lawyers for the work. If you want to be in business don't fall into the same trap as others and end up as a frustrated businessman working as a lawyer.

I would say though that your desire to have an escape route back to law suggests you may not have the right mentality for business. Business is making decisions, about taking risks and getting paid well only if it works out. Law is about not making decisions, being safe and getting paid well without taking any risks. You're going to be the sort of person happy with one or the other - you can't be both.

Work out which you are, make a choice and don't look back.

Magic Circle Senior Associate -24 Feb 2011 | 16:43

Robin Van Persie

"This is typical of a lot of young lawyers in City firms these days (by young I mean the straight out of university, and often of the GDL variety)."

In our experience we have this problem much less with GDL students than LLB students - the GDL students will often have selected law from several potential careers and looked into what it involves whereas the LLB students will simply go onto a training contract as the path of least resistance, it being what law graduates "do" and then decide they don't like the job.

You ARE coming across as somewhat bitter...

But hey, enjoy echoing through eternity with life in a City law firm.

Magic Circle Senior Associate -24 Feb 2011 | 16:49

Don't Get to 40 and regret it

When I was 27, against all the advice I heard, I bought a pub. I owned it for a couple of years, sold it for a huge profit and went straight back into my original profession (which happened to be accountancy). I have no regrets and the whole experience did me no harm at all. That was 20 years ago though and the job market is different now

However, you are young and have your qualification and your Oxbridge background and a top 20 training so you will always be able to make a living out of the law. Maybe not as a partner in the magic circle but enough to live indoors and eat hot food.

Don't get to 40 years old and think "I wish I'd taken that opportunity 16 years ago" Take it now while you can afford to take chances. Grasp it and work until you drop. If the rewards don't come fall back on the law. Ten years from now you could have a wife, kids and enormous mortgage. That means no choices at all.

Do it.

Consultant -24 Feb 2011 | 17:00

The law firm business model wants you to leave

If people like the lawyer asking the question didn't exist, the current model of law firms wouldn't work. Look at the way that graduate recruitment works in these firms: the largest firms will take on circa 100 fresh trainees each year, and if all of these were to be up for partnership 10-12 years down the line, there would be no decent profit share for partners a) because the equity would be spread so thinly and b) because the leveraged model of having an army of underlings billing more than they earn to make partner profits wouldn't be able to be maintained without massive, unsustainable growth.

There's a reason that Linklaters built in a 20% annual attrition rate in their New World restructuring: the model doesn't work without it.

Essentially, the model anticipates and relies upon people like the poster, and what he/she is doing is one of the first steps to helping a lucky few of his colleagues to the partnership.

However, the demand for rookies (I'd say about < 3 yrs PQE) lawyers is pretty low at present, so if you want out now, you should really be sure that this is what you want, since your options for returning will be limited.

Dave -24 Feb 2011 | 17:42

Burn your boats

Go for it! If you speak with senior lawyers in their forties, you will find a number of them who would not encourage their children to go into law now and who question whether, in the current climate, they would do the same again. If you keep in the back of your mind the idea that you will go back into law if it does not work out, this could impair your ability to commit yourself fully to the new role. Go away for the weekend, somewhere quiet, weigh up what you really want, then go for it and, as Cortes did to encourage his men, (in your own mind, to encourage yourself) burn your boats (but not your bridges). Courage!

Andrew -25 Feb 2011 | 10:23

Wah

Wah shield up - RVP's post must be a wah?

Wah shield down - okay, I've bitten - RVP, get some help my son, asap. Your post is verging on bonkers.

As to the query, give it a go - why not; if it doesn't work out I am sure you can get back into the legal profession, no dramas.

Right - time for a drink.

Arrse -25 Feb 2011 | 13:22

Don't listen to Van Persie

Robin Van Persie - you are obviously bitter about something. Just accept people change their minds and it has absolutely nothing to do with you.

OP - go for it, if you don't want to do the law, get out. But bear in mind, the grass isn't always greener.

John -25 Feb 2011 | 16:23

RVP needs stronger meds

RVP needs to get a grip on reality. The OP was good enough to get a TC and now wants to move on. He doesn't owe an apology to you or any other bitter wannabe that couldn't cut it against the competition.

OP - If your heart isn't in law for the long term and this role would have tempted you two or three years down the track, then take it with both hands, although the advice above that if it all comes undone you will struggle to get back into law at a decent firm (or in-house) is sound.

blah blah blah -01 Mar 2011 | 09:57

I think RVP might be a bit of an attention seeker. Done a pretty good job...

Northern Monkey -02 Mar 2011 | 17:02

Reality check for RVP

As someone who has tried and failed to get a TC, my reflexive response was to cheer loudly at RVP's suggestions. I don't believe what Magic Circle Senior Associate said at all; many people I know more or less blundered into law. Disillusionment seems to set in pretty quickly with many trainees and junior associates which suggests they didn't truly do their research before getting the job.

That said, this is the real world and you have to look out for your own interests. If you get a job you don't care for all that much at the expense of some poor schmuck who wants it a lot more, that's fine. C'est la vie. So to OP, if you've had enough of law and think there's something a lot more appealing elsewhere, go for it. Just don't expect to be able to go back to law easily if things don't work out. From what my friends in law tell me, the job market is really bad for juniors and the way the economy's going, it won't get better for years.

GimmeaTC -09 Mar 2011 | 17:38

Till you eat it up, how do you know how it tastes?

It's a fairly routine theme on Career Clinic for moans to be posted from folk who didn't get their TC about how their contemporaries got a TC but then didn't like it.

Consider this. Everyone pretty much (bar the odd exception) who applies for a TC wants it at the time. Maybe they did loads of research, maybe they didn't. But you, who did not get the TC, or found it harder to get than your ego felt right, who did not subsequently have the sinking feeling as the gloss wore off the recruitment brochure and you realised that your intelligence was principally being tested by "can you still do easy things whilst really tired", do not have the first hand experience to realise your dream may not match reality. The grass is always greener. So stop chucking rocks everytime Career Clinic gives you a chance, it is so tiresome. Pretty much everyone who has ever had a job has moaned about it at some point. That's why you get paid! If it was near-orgasmic levels of fun all the time (and my word, have I been deeply aroused by a warm document fresh from the printer in my time), you wouldn't get a decent wedge from it, would you?

OP, by all means go into business, but remember, that has every chance of bringing its own share of late nights and frustrations. You can get satisfaction from work, but don't make that your only source of it. My advice to you is to find a work/life balance, that still gives you enough wedge to enjoy your time out of work.

Stupot -10 Mar 2011 | 17:45

Follow your own counsel

It takes a lot of guts not to be a sheep. Work occupies a huge amount of our lives and law is not the only option. A lot of people choose law because their parents or teachers advised it without thinking it through or they had poor, if any, careers advice. The number of lawyers who hate law and also the shortage of opportunities says something.

Do what is right for you. No-one else has your values or is you so their opinion is of limited relevance - that is their map of the world. That is why coaches exists - to help you think through your OWN answers. You need to make your own decision. Good luck in whatever you decide.

talentliberator -18 Mar 2011 | 16:23

You Probably Know the Answer Already

A few reflections from an in-house lawyer who knows people on both sides of this question:

Law is more stable, prestigious and, unless you are very successful in a commercial role, generally better paid. Commercial roles can be more varied but are normally the first to go in a downturn. If you are someone who likes the prestige, money and safety, moving to a commercial role may, initially at least, be a shock. This is OK and should not put you off if you are determined, but you should be aware of it and not get disheartened by such a change.

Once you leave law, especially at the junior level, it will be difficult (likely impossible) to return, at least to a large firm.

Lawyers, as a rule, do not make good business people no matter how commercial someone claims to be, particularly private practice lawyers. This may be less of an issue if you have only recently qualified but I would suggest getting a taster before "burning your boats" just to confirm that you are suited. Moving in-house could be an interim step if you are in no hurry.

Me -23 Mar 2011 | 17:05