Career Clinic: Will make-up help me get made up?

We had a debate on this issue in the dept (bored lunch moment) and the overall conclusion is "no". There must be substance/legal skills if you seek progression. However, what is important is looking presentable and polished. Not looking like you rolled out of bed. This applies to both sexes.

Anonymous -16 Apr 2009 | 15:07

I think as long as you are well presented otherwise it should not really matter. It is important to look good and take pride in your appearance but if you are excellent at your job & clients like you, why feel pressure to wear lots of make-up? You should just be yourself!

Caroline -16 Apr 2009 | 15:08

Let me throw the grenade in - throughout my time in private practice I have seen plenty of people promoted on the basis that they are easy on the eye or they overtly flirt with those with the power to promote them. I've also seen it save less able people caught up in redundancy processes. It shouldn't be the case - but it undoubtedly is - that if you can catch the eye of the senior management by looking good then you have a much better chance of getting promoted. Many equity partners are lairy old men. Likewise so are many clients. It's not right but it is happening.

Axl -16 Apr 2009 | 15:56

You've made your pact with the Devil. It is for you to determine to what extent make-up is part of that pact. Personally, when I started my training contract, I threw away my DMs, straightened the mop of hair and applied suitable amounts of war paint at least to look more acceptable to my new audience. As Axl has said, it's all about making them think they've got what they expect.

City Woman -16 Apr 2009 | 16:18

Surely the question you should ask yourself is whether you want to work for that 64% of people who think how you look is more important than whether you're any good at your job? I've always taken the attitude that if I can't be myself at work then I'm working for the wrong people (and before anyone tells me I don't know what I'm talking about because I'm junior, I'm in my 30s and had a career before law). I certainly wouldn't start slapping chemicals over my face just to get a job.Incidentally, of the ten partners at my firm, two are female, and neither wear makeup.

Junior Associate -16 Apr 2009 | 17:31

You will seldom see a female partner in a top-tier firm who is poorly turned out.

Fred Huang, Solicitor, Magic Circle Firm -16 Apr 2009 | 17:33

You think law firms operate on a meritocratic system? The more ass you kiss, the better your chances of success. The same goes for any other superficial element of your being - including wearing make-up.

Matthew -16 Apr 2009 | 17:37

Studies show that first impressions are formed within milliseconds of meeting someone new. And that they are almost impossible to change. Do you really want your clients and colleagues thinking of you as the lazy, slovenly girl who can't be bothered? Even a quick swipe of mascara shows effort. And as someone said above plenty of people get promoted not on legal skills but on the basis of relationships, client and colleague relationships - being brutally honest, law is a male-dominated profession and being some nice eye candy definitely helps form the required relationships.

S. Cylla -16 Apr 2009 | 17:37

While it's regrettable that anyone has to adapt their personal style to safeguard their careers, the reality is that most women, regardless of age, do look more professionally-presented after the careful application of a little make-up and attention to their hair. When most firms are downsizing and so many careers are in jeopardy, it is surely wise to ensure that those still wishing to advance their careers are doing all they can to assist with this. Once they get to the most senior positions, then they are freer to live and present themselves just how they wish.

Sue Stapely, Quiller Consultants -16 Apr 2009 | 17:37

Yes, it will undoubtedly help you in your career if you put a bit more effort into your appearance. I find it necessary to look good and be charming to both clients and partners. The previous poster is right - they are almost always lairy old men and you've got to do what you can to get ahead. It might not be pc to say so, but it's true.

Female ass, magic circle -16 Apr 2009 | 17:56

In this day and age, increasingly women are now in positions of authority and the junior male employees need to take their appearance into consideration as well. I always ensure that I am well turned out for my female superiors and also stuff a sock into my boxers for added brownie points.

Anon -16 Apr 2009 | 18:03

In these choppy times it often is survival of the fittest - so bend forward at the drinking machine, liberally pick up papers with a scoop top and expose your shapely ankles. I can think of a firm in Nottinghamshire where you've got at least twice as good a chance as any other candidate if you're blonde and wear eye shadow. It's life, and provided your boss has good taste it can greatly improve your working environment.

Postmodernist -16 Apr 2009 | 18:11

Starting to wear some makeup won't save your job and not wearing it won't see you get the chop. But unfortunately it is one part of looking the part (and thus others considering you the part) for being a professional woman when you are being charged to clients at several hundred pounds an hour. A former (female) boss told that it was important to dress for the job that you want, not the job that you have. So I'd actually take a step back and look at your overall appearance including clothes, make up and hair - does the overall image that you portray mean that you look like a junior associate or could be a senior associate? If you look junior then consider what small changes you could make that could help e.g. a bit of mascara and tinted moisturiser. No need for an inch of slap.

In-houser -16 Apr 2009 | 18:49

As someone who regularly retains high quality legal advice, I can safely tell you that in my experience, a solicitor who looks after her own appearance, will look after her client.

C. Hippy -16 Apr 2009 | 19:36

Slap it on and see if it makes any difference. But as you don't usually use make up, make sure you go get professional advice. I recommend any of the make up counters at a big department store. They are usually manned by very made up ladies who should be able to sell you overpriced make up...with a free trowel thrown in too!

Ronald Oswald Forrester -16 Apr 2009 | 23:15

I don't really care. I am a partner in a City firm. We're in the worst recession I've ever seen, my clients are going bust and my wife has left me. So if you want to slap on some lippy go for it but don't expect me to notice. Sorry.

Crunched in corporate -16 Apr 2009 | 23:30

Your inner brilliance may shine through, but there's nothing wrong with giving it a helping hand. As suggested above, there's no need to trowel it on, and if you're not confident with it then start with one or two products and see how you go. The most important thing is a good base - whether a foundation or a tinted moisturiser, depending on how good your skin is. Then try a mascara (brown is easier to wear than black for most people) and a lip shine or gloss if you don't like the look of lipstick. A make-up lesson might help, but the in-store people will do the hard sell on lots of stuff you don't want or need. It would probably be cheaper to pay for a lesson with a make-up professional, so you don't feel obliged to buy, and they will be able to recommend products from different lines that will suit you best. But have a go and see what you think - if you really can't get on with it then at least you won't be wondering "what if...?"

Anonymous -17 Apr 2009 | 10:16

If you've got it already, perhaps no need to even try. But for most of us, it pays to make the most of what we've got. Isn't that so in any walk of life?

May -17 Apr 2009 | 10:53

A bit of appealing personality, smile and a twinkle will go a long way compared to red lipstick, slapped on face and tarty dress. Go figure.

Edam -17 Apr 2009 | 11:03

Interesting question. The female partners at my firm vary from relatively glam to plain Jane. It seems to make little difference and my respect is based on what they tell me not what they look like. But, having said that, what harm can it do? Be subtle though, otherwise it will seem blatant ass kissing and no-one likes a brown nose!

US Associate -17 Apr 2009 | 11:31

Short answer is "yes", but do it right and don't overdo it. It is incredibly common to have thick make up on. This is as much a class issue as anything else. So do the makeup but be "less is more". Also even though I reckon I'm the best lawyer at what I do in the UK I still like to wear high heels and tight skirts and look good. It's part of the fun as 20 years into this I've nothing left to prove. Do what feels right for you at the time. Attractive men and women if they are also competent can do better than the unattractive who are as competent. The good fairy at your christening/your genes have a lot to answer for both in what looks they bestow on you, you IQ and personality. As my mother always used to say - life isn't fair.

s -17 Apr 2009 | 11:34

I'm a recruiting partner at a big international firm. I can guarantee that if you applied for a job at my firm you would get turned down if you didn't look the part.

Laddy, Partner, US Firm -17 Apr 2009 | 11:38

Think about it logically. If you and someone else are entirely equal in technical ability, other than that she is more flirty, wears more makeup and therefore looks more appealing in an obvious manner and attracts more attention because of it at networking events and you are both in competition in a male-dominated environment, who's going to come off best? It's not rocket science!!

Anonymous -17 Apr 2009 | 11:46

It's perfectly reasonable for lawyers to be required to submit to a certain level of sartorial standard and overall smartness if they expect to get ahead in this business we call "law". You must remember that the first word of "fit in" is "fit".

Lord S -17 Apr 2009 | 12:53

Looking good will set you apart from the others. You'll find you don't have to try quite as hard as those less pleasing on the eye. Law is very much a personality contest. I find that brains, while useful, are generally optional.

Monk E Girkl -17 Apr 2009 | 14:28

I like a bit of make up on my female assistant, but then again she's my wife! One of the perks of high street practice.

L. Palmer, Tonbridge -17 Apr 2009 | 14:41

I am not the most attractive girl in the office and this has caused me no end of problems. Trainees that aren't as good as me get taken to client events just because they are prettier whereas I am stuck in the office doing the actual work.I've started to wear more appealing clothes and be more flirty. For example I will now lean on an associate's desk suggestively when taking instruction. This seems to be working and makes me terribly sad.

C. Haya -17 Apr 2009 | 15:02

I'm appalled by some of the comments here. If you think I'm coming into the office dressed as an Essex tart just to titillate my male superiors you have another thing coming. Pathetic, I'd hoped that this stuff was behind us but clearly I was mistaken.

G. Greer, Associate -17 Apr 2009 | 15:16

Would Alan Sugar's right-hand lady Margaret have got to her dizzy heights if she didn't comb her frizzy hair? I think not. Law is the same.

Alan Roffer -17 Apr 2009 | 15:47

Of course it makes a difference, unless you are so beautiful that gilding the lilly isn't needed. I once had a serious request from a client not to bring a dowdy trainee who had started working for me to the next meeting. They wanted the leggy redhead I had previously to take notes, pour tea and go for drinks afterwards. She was no oil painting but at least made an effort with a bit of slap, heels, cleavage etc.

Dullard -17 Apr 2009 | 16:21

Too much make-up makes you look like you have no style or taste. A little light make-up, however, can have benefits in making you look healthier, especially when doing long hours. I instruct external counsel and many of them look like death warmed up - most off-putting. The men can't do much about it, but fortunately the women can.

Anonymous -17 Apr 2009 | 17:20

All women should wear make up everyday...it is outrageous for them not to! The rougher you are, the more you should slap on in the mornings and just hope and pray that you get through the day! Good heavens, what is the world coming to when anything to the contrary is even being considered?

Anonymous -17 Apr 2009 | 17:42

I am willing to admit (behind the comfort of my computer) that I have hired many females based on looks alone.I'm not the only one, it's fairly common, though not many would admit it.A partner at my last (US) firm actually once got rid of a paralegal as she was fairly unattractive and never made an effort - he made no attempt at hiding this.

Magic Circle Partner -17 Apr 2009 | 21:39

There is a right load of cobblers being talked on this thread.First up, there seems to be an assumption that wearing make-up is linked with being flirty/attractive which ain't necessarily so....Secondly, I could not believe the muppet above who said that if someone took pride in their appearance, they would also look after their clients. In my experience, the lawyers who really look after their clients generally look terrible, often wear ill-fitting clothes and generally would be a major target for a makeover. On the other hand, many of those turned out in beautiful tailor-made suits could barely draft to save their life...and are too busy trying to look good to give a stuff about their clients.Finally, female partners really do come in all shapes and sizes but really glam ones are few and far between so no need to change what you are doing (assuming that you are washing and grooming regularly).

Overseas Partner -18 Apr 2009 | 15:39

Yes i'm afraid you have to make an effort. I got where I am because I genuinely appeal to the aesthetic. Don't worry if you aren't a work of art - The Mona Lisa is still in good shape after all.

MC trainee -19 Apr 2009 | 16:51

You don't neccessarily have to plaster on the slap to look smart and professional, you know. My wife doesn't wear make up and she leaves the house every day looking very presentable.

face painter -20 Apr 2009 | 18:51

I'm very attractive and regularly get asked for my phone number by complete strangers when out and about. I never, ever wear make-up to work and when I did once go through a phase of doing so, got treated absolutely no differently. If you buy into this guff then you perpetuate it. All this crap about "that's unfortunately just the way it is" makes my blood boil. Such defeatism is what allows negative attitudes like racism, sexism and homophobia thrive. If you're not part of the solution, you're part of the problem, after all...

Seagullade -21 Apr 2009 | 17:16

If you can be yourself and have an outrageous style then I think the stuffy world of law needs to shift a bit - the forensic scientist in NCIS would be fab style!!! Or the CSI girls!!! I once had to do a demonstration and stupidly wore nail polish; my boss was more interested in my nail polish and ridiculing me before counsel and clients.

ANON -22 Apr 2009 | 00:24